Landing Pages -- Can TiddlyWiki Learn From Them?

[cdaven]

My writing here sometimes serve a “hidden” purpose, which is to discover the whats, what-nots, whos and whys about the community and software. If I propose or oppose something, I’m both giving my feedback about some implementation detail and waiting to see what the response tells me about the community.

This kind of dynamic is much harder in a digital discussion forum, but the purpose is the same as in physical meetings at a company. It’s not just facts and figures, it’s also about who you should be talking to, what’s the general direction of the work, what are the recurring themes, why are they doing this, what do they believe in and so on.

So if I throw out a few crazy ideas, I don’t expect someone else to make them come true. A great answer could maybe be,

1. Yes, that is a good idea, because it aligns with our values and the current roadmap, that you can find here
2. Maybe you could cooperate with NN on this, who is already very knowledgeable in the area?
3. See this link for more information about contributing to the software or community

Or, of course, “No, we don’t want to do that, because X”. Or “Not now, but can you create an issue on Github, so we can revisit this in 6 months?”

Since I don’t hear that, I’m still trying to find out how I can contribute.

[boris]

I’m giving you feedback as what is missing … which is people picking up some responsibilities and getting stuff done

From GitHub to home pages, Jeremy could use some self directed volunteers. If you’re interested in taking things on — go for it!

[boris]

Yes and no Who is the audience is the starting point for a landing page for sure.

But maybe it doesn’t go on the dotCom home page but rather elsewhere, and we ask Jeremy for a subdomain.

Thanks for digging into this @twMat and kicking off a community project.

[anon5541130]

@cdaven Hi! How are you? great examples!

[TW_Tones]

I revisited this reply of @cdaven because of @eduardo.caiojoao30’s mention.

@cdaven

Suggestions

What dawned on me is these are “landing pages”, and need not be the whole website.

• It should be quite easy to provide a way to deliver tiddlywiki in a different layout as a landing page and for selected tiddlers but also return to the standard layout when you navigate elsewhere.
• That is for the general audience or new visitor they see something akin to a regular website, but it is only a shell.

[Anakowi]

Isn’t that the beauty of a website/domain — you can stream the version that’s right for the user?

Deliver firstly from a marketing/beginner perspective, a working example of a very basic wiki, that offers step by step instruction with screenshots etc. using only the default editor toolbar options.

Provide links to a similar enhanced version, that brings in the next level of customisations — the ones that require the user to learn inline HTML/CSS… and then another more advanced version, and so on. Always allowing the option to delve as deeply as you like or need, into your own fully customised wiki.

[pmario]

@Anakowi

Isn’t that the beauty of a website/domain — you can stream the version that’s right for the user?

Deliver firstly from a marketing/beginner perspective, a working example of a very basic wiki, that offers step by step instruction with screenshots etc. using only the default editor toolbar options.

Sure, but expecting it to exist without someone making those step by step introductions is wishful thinking.

We do have a huge pile of open issues at GitHub. Many of them are documentation related. But without community help they will not happen.

[Anakowi]

@pmario

Sure, but expecting it to exist without someone making those step by step introductions is wishful thinking.

We do have a huge pile of open issues at GitHub. Many of them are documentation related. But without community help they will not happen.

I’m not up to speed, but I’d be happy to help with content since I’m already putting together a tutorial wiki for a friend. I saw the list of tasks. LOL oddly enough I have a GitHub account — when I visit that place I feel like a stowaway or imposter. But I did once develop a no frills alternative to Wordpress, it got zero interest.

[Mark_S]

@pmario

We do have a huge pile of open issues at GitHub. Many of them are documentation related. But without community help they will not happen.

Failing to mention that the current contribution process is like building a ship in a bottle blind-folded in the middle of a rave. There needs to be a more wiki-like contribution process.

[TW_Tones]

@Anakowi

ou’re quickly steered into the deep end before you’re ready

• I agree with this a lot, even although I was happy to jump into the deep end, I felt forced to far too often.
• As an IT Professional I also had an advantage, but having a detailed knowledge of “Procedural languages did not help much”.
• What limitations there are in the documentation and tools available to users cause damage not by Grose damage but by a thousand small, almost trivial, cuts.

In many ways this experience is why I actively support the community and Tiddlywikis evolution, and it gets better every day. If I can make the next persons journey a little easier, I am happy. Never the less TiddlyWiki is a valuable investment in time and effort, as it’s capabilities extend towards infinity in many directions.

• But how can I express this adequately to a new comer?

[TiddlyTweeter]

@TW_Tones

… it’s capabilities extend towards infinity in many directions.

• But how can I express this adequately to a new comer?

Bingo!

The one or the many?

The infinitude is exactly one big promo issue, I think?

Just early thoughts, TT

[TiddlyTweeter]

@TW_Tones

TiddlyWiki is a valuable investment in time and effort, as it’s capabilities extend … in many directions.

• But how can I express this adequately …?

Right. I’m gonna use two visual metaphors that I hope explicate the issue graphically …

---

1 - Advanced Yoga (TW Developer) … Once you know what you doing you can do this …

---

2 - Intermediate Yoga (TW Starter) … All learners need to work a bit before you get there …

---

My point? What is TiddlyWiki for?

I very much doubt most users ever need to master “leg behind the head.”

A comment, TT

[TW_Tones]

Brave go at visualising. In part my original point of is most people don’t plan to be a yoga guru even if they may dream about it. In a similar way we want users to consider there value adopting tiddlywiki without becoming a tiddlywiki guru, unfortunately I think people see a tiddlywiki guru as a JavaScript coder and this turns them off even starting.

It makes me wonder if we introduced white through black belts like karate they would see the value in the intermediate belts without a belief in reaching black belt. Perhaps we should start a thread the TiddlyWiki achievement belts for example Understanding the Meaning of Karate Belt Colors or perhaps we have stars, or fishes and we display the fishes we believe we can handle.

[TiddlyTweeter]

@TW_Tones

makes me wonder if we introduced white through black belts like karate they would see the value in the intermediate belts without a belief in reaching black belt.

… as an entry point it might work if an entrantee had free choice on belts / cats / stars / fish levels.

Just a comment, TT

[Springer]

@TW_Tones

if we introduced white through black belts like karate they would see the value in the intermediate belts without a belief in reaching black belt. Perhaps we should start a thread the TiddlyWiki achievement belts for example

Even here, I notice the plurality of ways of moving toward becoming “power users”.

Some people begin going to town with fields and table-like data structure, some with complex tag-based TOC and navigational structures, others with css and layout tweaks, others with transclusions and macros, others with various plugins…

I’d be reluctant to put these into any linear order, because any one of those development routes might be the most important learning path for a given user.

Grok Tiddlywiki is great at offering one careful more-or-less linear path, but it’s just one path – geared toward a certain kind of learner with certain kinds of tasks (managing notes as a new employee).

Touching again on original question, I do think a well-designed (graphically engaging, and readable) landing page is valuable… the challenge (as folks notice) is to find the balance between simplicity and power.

-Springer

[TW_Tones]

@Springer

@TW_Tones

TiddlyWiki achievement belts for example

Even here, I notice the plurality of ways of moving toward becoming “power users”.

yes, I said as much myself recently. Then we need to find another metaphor but one which ideally deals with both the plurality and the progressive levels.

Actually its starting to look like different paths , almost like snakes and ladders, where the snakes get you back to something you bypassed earlier.

• Unfortunately snakes have too many connotation’s, including as sliding backwards.

I may be naïve, but I am confident we can find a model/metaphor which is useful to most people, and on which we could hang key documentation.

What about the TiddlyWiki galaxy model?

• The many worlds model of TiddlyWiki?
• This is the best fit I can think of so far. Because in reality tiddlywiki is many worlds and inhabitants ,and there are always more to discover. You can even build your own.
• However as an astronomy / cosmology enthusiast I may be overstating the general utility of this metaphor.
• An onion may work but they can be smelly

Architecture of the TiddlyWiki galaxy model

• Inner $:/core
• Central bulge - Core Plugins
• Outer bulge other plugin planets and
  • some Editions like “solar systems” ie “rotates around project management”
• Spiral arms - different paths to follow outwards to a goal
  • Where different planets and solar systems arise
  • New Goal?, add new spiral arm and a path moving outward from the core
• TiddlyWiki 5.3.x a new merging satellite galaxy ?
• There ae also thousands of space memes we can play with
  • Including the tiddler “Babel fish” - TiddlyWiki’s Guide to the galaxy

Then people would accumulate stars and planets in various spiral arms.

Do I sound like a “mad man”, an “add man”?

This is not Off topic - Such a theme could be the theme for a landing page such that the metaphor indicates;

"There is more, much more, just explore".

[TW_Tones]

Looking at landing page content;

Part of promoting TiddlyWiki is explaining the name,

In the process of developing a standard starter edition as above I wrote Its All in the name addressing this somewhat. Copy below.

• a home landing page and modern look
• attractive introduction to tiddlywiki helping people identify its use for them

Please also see my attempt to find a metaphor for tiddlywiki Landing Pages -- Can TiddlyWiki Learn From Them? - #37 by TW_Tones where The TiddlyWiki Galaxy may be a good one.

Is anyone here handy with annotating images?

Images my be copy written

[pmario]

@TW_Tones

What about the TiddlyWiki galaxy model?

IMO way to abstract. … The OP lists some landing pages with a “powerful 1 liner”, where all of them will also work for TiddlyWiki.

So we can steal them - remix and we would probably good to go.

The second brain - to own your thoughts. – done

Then there need to be some more detailed Edition links with a “call to action”

• Test Online Buttons
• Try yourself.
• Download

and we are done.

[Justin_H]

What about:

"TiddlyWiki is,

A Recipe Book.
[Demo thumbnail]

A Personal Blog.
[Demo thumbnail]

A Second Brain.
[Demo thumbnail]

A Digital Journal.
[Demo thumbnail]

A Notetaking Wiki.
[Demo thumbnail]

TiddlyWiki is whatever you want it to be.

all saved into a single file, saved anywhere you want,

and it all starts here, with your first tiddler."

[twMat]

@Justin_H

What about:

"TiddlyWiki is,

…

Nice! A very concrete overview of applications to convey the multitude and give the visitors actual starting points aligning with their interests, and with direct links to demos or editions for this.