Let's brainstorm a name for the next version of TiddlyWiki

[Scribs]

i like quinecard / quinecards too keeping it in the singular is more of a reference to hypercard too, not sure if we want to be that closely associated with it or not.

also to note, the poll above does currently indicate a 63% preference (among people who care enough to find this thread and vote) towards keeping the name the same. it is fun to brainstorm names, and if jeremy is looking for a new name then it isn’t really relevant, but i figured it’s worth mentioning. from all the excitement about new names i figured it would be more of an even split.

[TW_Tones]

It is importiant to note if using “Quine” in relation to tiddlywiki that more often than not people discussing Quines are discussing “trivial or minimal Quines” where tiddlywiki is a “non-trivial Quine” so perhaps we could find a better word such as “sophisticated Quine” to avoid the use of the negative.

If we use Quine Card, we need only adopt it as a community and add it to the documentation. No need to rename tiddler, just add value dont destroy value.

• I like quine card as it also hints that it can be both data and TiddlyWiki script.

[nemo]

@TW_Tones

No need to rename tiddler, just add value dont destroy value.

Given I think “tiddler” adds negative value, the faster it’s remamed, gone, dead and buried, the better it is from a long term value perspective.

@jeremyruston

over the years I’ve had consistent feedback that there is a significantly sized cultural group that finds the name at best patronising and at worst obscene.

Jeremy was talking about “tiddlywiki”, and I wonder if the broad reaction to “tiddler” is known. Same basic reaction? Or are the people who’d be put off by it, already largely filtered out by being put off by ‘tiddlywiki’?

[TW_Tones]

I have no problem what so ever with TiddlyWiki and Tiddler, so we are going to differ on this, perhaps for eternity. In addition they both have substantial internet search value due to their uniqueness.

• I also imagin what ever we chose there would be a cohort that did not like it.
• In a muylti-cultural space like a global software tool the chance of not triggering someones distast is very low. Names will always be a contention so we may as well stick with what we have.

I did read your prior comment, mine own include using “TiddlyWiki Platform”, Tweaky as a nic name and a recent discussion of tiddler/Card.

[nemo]

@TW_Tones

substantial internet search value due to their uniqueness

100% agreed. That’s the one good thing it has going for it.

@TW_Tones

I also imagin what ever we chose there would be a cohort that did not like it.

Yeah probably - especially if it’s an invented or obscure word

@TW_Tones

In a muylti-cultural space like a global software tool the chance of not triggering someones distast is very low. Names will always be a contention so we may as well stick with what we have.

This seems to be saying “since anything will be a problem for someone, why bother?” which I completely disagree with. Even on the premise that any possible name will have some distaste to someone, the levels of distaste are not equal. From both a “how many people will be put off by a name” and “for what reason is it offputting”, some names will be distinctly less disagreeable than than others.

Finding a significantly less disagreeable to those who don’t (yet) know of this software, AND being subjectively agreeable to the tastes of those of us who do already use it?

TidWiki / TidbitWiki has been my favourite alternative since really thinking about this - but I know that’s objectionable to some. QuineCards I really like too - and nobody has noted it as objectionable yet, and this very thread is already the #3 result for a google search for quinecards - I’d expect a full rebrand would quickly bump it to the top, and it’d probably inherit a lot of the existing tiddlywiki search results easily enough too.

[Birthe]

QuineCard/QuineCards is good. I do absolutely not think "sophisticated Quine’’ would be good.
Most people do not know of or talk about quine. Those who do know and discuss it should be triggered - be curious.
I remember a talk Jeremy had with to younger programmers - sorry I do not remember the link. Their Eyes light up when quine was mentioned- interest shown. Curiosity and interest is necessary to start using tiddlywiki and keep going. (It takes some time to fall in love, you know!)

[pmario]

@nemo

TidWiki / TidbitWiki has been my favourite alternative since really thinking about this - but I know that’s objectionable to some. QuineCards I really like too - and nobody has noted it as objectionable yet, and this very thread is already the #3 result for a google search for quinecards - I’d expect a full rebrand would quickly bump it to the top, and it’d probably inherit a lot of the existing tiddlywiki search results easily enough too.

hmm. Sorry - I do not like TidWiki and I do not like QuineCards.

I am not overly happy with “tidbit” for tiddler, but as Jeremy mentioned, it will be compatible with the existing .tid files. I do like tidbit more than something quine related.

Since I use TW mainly for brainstorming and to get “ideas” out of my head. It’s OK if my notes are named tidbits.

IMO TidWiki is hard to “say” – Why do we need to keep the term “wiki” in the project name at all?

[dongrentianyu]

Wiki is an attractive word, or at least I was attracted to the wiki properties of TiddlyWiki. The note-taking software currently on the market pushes the concept of a second brain, a database of sorts, but I prefer the term personal wiki. A personal wiki means that one can consolidate what one has learnt on one platform, with each revision coming from a different time in one’s life. And In addition to knowledge, a personal wiki can also contain more content, such as a successful experience and the many failed attempts behind it. These can be documented in detail and organised through links.

[TW_Tones]

@dongrentianyu

A personal wiki

I think this is going to capture some peoples attention more than a note book, cards etc… but not others, It demonstrates the value of a diverse set of ways to describe tiddlywiki. A personal wiki would have caught my attention decades ago because I used and built wikis, and saw value in a personal one. I wonder how many people have a more than skin deep understanding of wikis.

In reality “a non-linear personal web notebook” caught my attention because I was into heirachical tree solutions but needed to leave the linear. But then I expect I am somewhat strange.

[EricShulman]

I like alliteration:

Portable Programmable Platform for Personal Productivity

-e

[TW_Tones]

@EricShulman

Portable Programmable Platform for Personal Productivity

I had those same words in my head at this point of the conversation

Now;

Portable Programmable Platform for Personal Productivity or Publishing.

The 5 P’s platform

• Portable Programmable Personal Productivity Publishing - Platform

[nemo]

@pmario

Why do we need to keep the term “wiki” in the project name at all?

I dont think we do. QuineCards wasn’t the first suggested name without "wiki’ and I’m sure it wont be the last.

To me, the advantage of “TidWiki” (with “tidbits”) is simply that it’s shorter and less gross than what we currently have, but feels phonetically related and some of the existing conventions (like the .tid suffix) carry over logically.

So as much as I think a new and unique name will pick up the existing search karma pretty quick, “TidWiki” will do that even quicker (presumably in part because it’s similar, and likely in part because it’s been conceptually linked to TiddlyWiki via threads like this one for some time now)

FWIW, I definitely found TW via the “wiki” name (I’ve been of a “every website problem is a nail, wiki’s are my hammer” mindset since the early 2000s)

[TankinatorFR]

@pmario

tidbit

As I pointed previously I do fear that this sound way too close to an expression people in french-speaking countries would use to designate sexual organs in an insulting way.
The only phonetic difference come from the “d” that should be a “t”, but most french accents make them hard to distinguish when they are at this position in the word. This could become a problem in a significant number of countries.

[duarte.framos]

QuineCards could also make for some decent logos

[stobot]

Although QuineCards is probably better, if it was Card Quine we could play on the fact that a Quine is like an infinite loop

[TW_Tones]

QC in Australia and England (I believe) means Queens Council is a title given to senior barristers (solocitors/attorney), now more commonly known as Senior Counsel (SC) or King’s Counsel (KC).

I suppose with the demise of the Queen this letter combination will be free for redefinition, and the english crown is unlikey to have a queen for another generation at least. Yes, I am not a monarchist.

[nemo]

I like the thinking, though my first reaction was that QC could get the same nearly-infinity-symbol effect, so long as the tail of the Q was handled well.

Of course, then I went to play with fonts and instead ended up with the tail of the Q linking to the C, which is a totally different (but relevant) implication!

@TW_Tones

QC in Australia and England (I believe) means Queens Council (…) I suppose with the demise of the Queen this letter combination will be free for redefinition

I suspect there wouldn’t be many two letter combinations, if any, that are free from some kind of existing meaning to someone. (My first thought with “QC” was the long running webcomic “Questionable Content”) (and my second thought was “Quantum Chess”, which is an online game my brother and I half-developed a year ago, and toyed with various “QC” based logos for that, the current draft there ended up being called ‘Qhess’)

[yan]

Of course, then I went to play with fonts and instead ended up with the tail of the Q linking to the C, which is a totally different (but relevant) implication!

I like that it looks a bit like with a smile underneath!