Let's brainstorm a name for the next version of TiddlyWiki

#181

One person abandoning a solution because of aesthetics is their problem. Many people being put off by the name is the project’s problem.

(fwiw, I am pretty ambivalent about “Tiddlywiki”, but find I have to apologise for “tiddlers” the first time I mention it in tiddlywiki contexts to a non-Tiddlywiki person, because to me it sounds like something much much worse (I dont see spoiler tags, so I’ve dropped a short explanation externally: https://generic-trademark.com/t.txt)

Ooh, I like that - though might be worth some colour/border tweaking so it’s not looking like TVVX. It reminds me of a wiki logo I did up for myself 20 years ago:
wikilogo4

#182

True certainly needs some work. Maybe the whole W with the same color, maybe less spacing, or streamline it more. I’d love to work on it if it ever gained support.

Either way, it’s just a quick mock-up to support my point.

#183

The problem will persist with most alternatives suggested here.
There is too many languages and cultures, and you will always find some where a specific world is problematic. It might be possible to find a name that won’t sound problematic in the major languages, but if we add the different cultures and sub-cultures, it will became infinitely difficult.

#184

i appreciate the explanation (linked) here and fully agree it is the main reason why i am hesitant to recommend TW to more people. a general comment:

it may not be an issue to you (general you), but please recognize it is to a lot of people and that is only hurting TW’s popularity.

also:

that doesn’t mean we can’t try to make something sound at least palatable to the language(s) used by the vast majority of users (english and possibly chinese as well). especially if we are having ongoing discussions on expanding the user base, making the platform more friendly to first-time users, and monetization options.

edit: expanded the context of the quote.

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#185

That’s not what I said. And don’t forget french and spanish, also widely used. Some of the suggestions seen in this discussion literally designated sexual organs in theses languages.

What I pointed is that finding a name that won’t sound offensive in major languages is already a challenge, but that accounting for variations of theses languages in specific countries will make it close to impossible. Nothing more.

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#186

While the word may not be immediately familiar to some people, a “tiddler” refers to a small fish, generally found in ponds and streams. Thus, a TiddlyWiki (a group of tiddlers) is like a school of fish, all operating together in a coordinated manner.

See my explanation of the name here: Inside TiddlyWiki: What’s In A Name

… and also a children’s story book: “Tiddler: The Story Telling Fish”

-e

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#187

I agree with “it’s a challenge” - the longevity of this thread is testament to that. I don’t agree with “close to impossible”. That projects, businesses, people, etc regularly come up with names used globally without issue, I think is testament to it being possible.

interesting! I assumed (like you wrote that some would) that it was a reference to Tiddlywinks - I thought that name came first, and ‘tiddlers’ was derived backwards from it.

Australia has a weird mix of English and US influence, and in this case “Tiddler” didn’t make it down under, so it lacked any pre-made meaning to provide context or hint as to what it meant or was referencing.

None of this really changes that I feel that the naming needs to change (or my dislike for that word), but I have gained a better understanding of why those who don’t have a direct issue with it may in fact find it very resonant and suitable and argue for retention.

#188

I mean we could call it minnow wiki, since that’s the US equivalent

#189

Yes, I suggested this above, but I didn’t really mean it, as I think we’re better off sticking with what we have.

#190

Just remember how valuable tiddlywiki and tiddler are very good search terms, try them in google, we do not want to loose this, this is why I persist in extending the name to something like “TiddlyWiki Platform” if mentioned enough will come up in searches. Similarly “tiddler note” etc… may assist.

#191

Tiddler was fish with a big imagination. Love that book. Have read it many times.
Not sure how iPlayer works for non brits but here’s a link to the lovely animated version on the BBC.

Tiddler: www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/m0026dm6 via @bbciplayer

#192

How about Tweaky?

  1. Similar to TiddlyWiki

  2. Short and easy to say

  3. Captures one of the key features of TiddlyWiki, its infinite tweakability

  4. Follows basic English spelling, thinking of users for whom English is a second language

  5. Okay there is a negative meaning I found on searching the definition (“behaving in an agitated or compulsive manner, often under the influence of stimulant drugs”), but a) it is context-dependent and wouldn’t be thought of in the context of an app. b) I had never heard of tweaky used in that way before, so it may not be too widespread, and c) that meaning is a good description of how most tw users become after using TiddlyWiki :slight_smile:

  6. We could easily put an explanatory subtitle: “Tweaky: the infinitely tweakable notetaking platform”

Question: can we just gather the current options and take a community vote? Or can @jeremyruston make a decision based on the full list or at least narrow it down? We create long threads about having a new name for TiddlyWiki, or leaving it as is, about once a year, but the threads never get anywhere.

#193

Sorry I didn’t see this post before commenting something really similar this morning! Great minds think alike, though I am still more open to the idea than you after your edit.

#194

Tweaky! an addictive notetaking meth-od!

#195

A comment on the negative. It is definitely not an issue.
That usage is rare and pretty much an isolated usage of some local drug sub-cultures.

(footnote: Also the use of “Tweak”=“Harlot” ceased in 1719.)

Tweak’s more recent etymology does fit well as it already fits standard working procedures of people like you; and others who are even more nerd like …
It is respectable, active, individually done. A nice thing.
Overall v. good. So: Bingo! But …

My concern is Tweaky might be too generic to fit TW precisely enough?? And thereby might be slightly confusing?

I mean, who isn’t a Tweaker? I guess some Twerkers aren’t?

You get my point?

#196

I agree the drug slang usage isn’t an issue and is pretty rare.

I don’t mind generic if it’s still accurate. tbh, my first reaction to “tweaky” is that as a spoken word, it’s confusingly similar to the existing “twiki” (unless it’s common to pronounce that as tee-wiki? I’ve always pronounced it almost identical to how I’d pronounce ‘tweaky’, just with a shorter vowel both sides of the ‘k’)

My second reaction was ‘does this even address renaming “tiddlers”’?

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#197

Good point. ATM “TiddlyWiki” semantically resonates both with the full tool (wiki) and it’s atomic units (tiddlers). “Tweaky” relates to it principally as an overall system/tool/method.

#198

Call them tweaks. Or tweakies. Or something generic like notes or notecards. Just because Jeremy decided to give a distinct a name to tiddlers doesn’t mean it has to continue. What other notetaking tool names its notes? Does Obsidian have sids? Does Evernote have evers? Does OneNote have onesies?

Tinker might also be a good alternative to Tweaky. With tiddlers being called tinks.

#199

Tweaky or Tweaker (the overall tool) and Tweaks (it’s basic units) is growing on me.

Note … I gave up on the TW naming contests long ago as they never got anywhere.
However, with your suggest, I find myself sort of in support of a Tweak-ish name.

Why? “Tweak” is pretty much a common term in international computer English.

That said, “tweak” is very generic and I’m not sure it communicates much about TW specifics beyond it being tweaker friendly? TiddlyWiki does (once understood) imply more about it’s nature.

Thoughts, TT

#200

I don’t think the name has to be 100% relevant or explanatory. Reasons:

  1. As an example, Obsidian tells you nothing about the product. Nothing.

  2. In the case of TiddlyWiki, we have all commented numerous times here that it is impossible to encapsulate what TiddlyWiki is, even in a longer sentence or short paragraph, because it can do so much and users can use for so many different purposes. So why would we think we could encapsulate all that in a short name?

  3. A tagline like “The infinitely tweakable wiki notetaking platform” could do some of the heavy lifting.

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