Ex-pat or immigrant?

Café
#1

Hmm do I dare make this comment especially since the thing I am seizing on was meant perfectly innocently.

These days when I find myself living in a country not of my birth ( and I have moved around Europe extensively ) I call myself an immigrant rather than an expat. The latter word puts a bad taste in my mouth because I have noted over time how selectively the words expat and immigrant are used - I do get it! The word expat was originally used by people from country A to talk about someone else from country A who has moved to live in country B and people in country C would just say immigrant - ie expat means - “over there but originally from here” - however this is rarely how the distinction between expat pans out in reality - people from country C will usually say immigrant if they have a predujice and expat if they feel the person involved is “like us but not actually one of us”

I won’t say more because I don’t want to raise an off topic storm but I feel sufficiently motivated when I see the “expat” term to mention it in a friendly way so that people might reflect on the way we use these two words.

The Worst Feature of Tiddlywiki
#2

Innocently and correctly.

[1] Expatriate - Wikipedia (via OED)
[2] Expat Definition & Meaning - Merriam-Webster
[3] Expatriate Definition

Perhaps you’re falling foul of some misappropriated “baggage”?

#3

Interesting. I hadn’t heard of that contrast of terms in that discriminatory way

In Mexico we US citizens call each other expats and talk about the expat community, and Mexicans call us gringos, hueros or estadounidenses.

Mexicans use migrante to refer to the people of many countries trying to get to the US thru Mexico.

I don’t recall ever hearing the word imigrante used here of anyone from any country.

#4

In Australia here are immigrants, people now making Australia home, and Expats are often people well paid by an international company and making Australia home for a limited period. Although some do become migrants the general impression is they are temporary residents. My experience is with French Expats to Australia and other countries because French firms value international experience, however as a result most expats are cashed up, and a few somewhat separate themselves from the local culture.

There are however trends towards “World Citizens” at least for people with skilled and in demand professions who enjoy living and experiencing local cultures everywhere, some embrace the local culture more than others, it largely depends on how much their work keeps them in a bubble or not, as well as their willingness top embrace differences. Sometimes we would call these expats but perhaps not if they work for local businesses.

I personal have grownup alongside many different peoples, cultures and races and tend to treat everyone as “World Citizens”. I love diversity and see good in everyone, I treasure what different perspectives bring, including the indigenousness cultures which are sometimes treated as outsider’s by the people who are the actual outsiders.

TiddlyWiki is a virtual community of World citizens in my view

Like me our community also sems to hold true;

If is is not nice or constructive to say something, don’t say it, there is already plenty of criticism around (including self-criticism) we don’t need anymore. This community seems to live this.

@DaveGifford consider these two words perhaps;

There are several ways of remembering how to distinguish between these words: people are emigrants when they leave their country of origin, and immigrants when they arrive at their destination , or an emigrant is given an additional M when moving to a new country.

@jonnie45 it would be my personal approach in your situation to reject the labelling of you as anything but a world citizen where possible. There is usually too much baggage in many other these terms, generalisations, different perspectives and racism etc… for them to offer much value, and anyway which word applies to you may only be determined at the end of your life and what you eventually do.

#5

Ha! Though somewhat off TW, it is interesting.

I think it depends on the context & what you are doing &, I guess, your personage.

Just FYI, as a Brit who has lived in Italy for over a decade I basically feel Italian now.

However, because of “Brexit” (UK leaving the EU) everything got complicated recently. And to get rights, even though I had residence already, I had to re-register as if I were a “refugee”.

Regarding “expats” specifically, here in Italy, that term doesn’t mean a lot in most regions practically. Though in Tuscany it would as the British community there is huge. A kinda “Little Britain.”

“Expat” culturally is very much related to whether people who share an origin share that origin collectively overseas; when there are sufficient numbers of them. I mean that is the “practical” side of it.

I don’t do that. Partly because I live in a small city that is multicultural, where many people speak English (which helps me), yet where there are hardly any English people (I know one other amongst our 34,000).

My point: the ups or downs of being an “expat” are very context dependent. Sometimes it is helpful. Sometimes it is irrelevant.

Just a comment, TT