Tiddlywiki is a templating machine, where to now?

#1

As a long time user of TiddlyWiki I can tell you Tiddlywiki is a templating machine. Its core depends on it, multiple mechanisiums are available to designers and users alike. Templates are both broad in definition and use, within tiddlywiki with transclusion, procedures and filters, turbo charging the ways they can be used.

So diverse are the posibilities of templates in tiddlywiki. there are many kinds of which we speak in these forums and it is sometimes confusing as to what is being discussed. The following are a few types of templates and these can be combined.

  • display templates
  • Tiddler templates
  • core templates
  • content templates
  • code templates
    • reusable code
    • plugin, button, action, tag any tiddlywiki object template
  • wiki templates
    • editions
    • demos…
  • exportable content templates
    • files
    • html json etc…
    • zip files

Today I was thinking there is another kind of template, I may call a functional template, which includes a button or trigger containing the steps to create another tiddler. There may not be any other template involved, with all the details stored within a button or actions.

So once you consider the above and hybrid templates using two or more templating methods, we get quite a few combinations.

Where to now?
I started this discussion to encorage a shared community effort in this subject. Do we need to develop a more mature language about templates? Can we curate this broad subject to make it easier to understand and share insights?

  • perhaps we can multiply the posibilities by building on tiddlywikis strengths, to be the premier templating machine, inside and outside tiddlywiki?
  • what does a more mature templating machine look like to you?
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#2

Re: what does a more mature templating machine look like to you?

It looks like dataflow visual programming patchbay toolkit instruments

Visual Thinking & Io

Max (Cycling74)
PureData

Storypace ((((long ago on a Mac)))

KeyKit (TimThompson)

BespokeSynth

Rhino3d >> Grasshopper

SidefX>> Houdini

Blender nodes

Cables.gl

#3

Thanks @Jason_Cunliffe, unfortunatly I know few of these. If you can add links to an overview of each of these, in your above reply, it would help a lot, we can make better use of your knowledge here.

#4

based on my experience with some of those mentioned tools, it seems like they are talking about putting templates and tiddlers together like nodes connected by “pipes” or “wires”, some screenshots:

Max

1504×618 139 KB

Blender

cables

while it does seem like there is promise to viewing interactions between tiddlers in this way i am not sure if the “node input/output” format used by these tools fits how tiddlers are organized (which i see more as “pieces of other sources patchworked together”). @Jason_Cunliffe we would be interested to hear more on your vision!

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#5

quoting @Scribs : “patchworked together” ← KEY

Clearly, there are lines/cables/routes one can discern, but those models don’t cover the “venn diagrammatic” nature of (at least some of) my wikis. I mean, they don’t “bring out” the transcluded nature of TiddlyWiki. It’s (they’re) simply not “boxes talking to boxes”.

:man_shrugging:

#6

it would be pretty awesome to be able to see a line going from the transcluded piece back to its source though, almost like the original project xanadu concept which i am sure was an inspiration for TW:

image
image1024×768 181 KB

image
image794×637 28.3 KB

extending a visualization tool like tiddlymap to be a full interface for editing and manipulating wiki data / references / templates would be (imo) a very powerful and a natural “mature” interface for this type of data!

#7

Interesting perspective @Scribs and I could see visualisation tools being very helpful. I have often kept in mind how easy it is to make Knowledge/Information and Code development tools on top of tiddlywiki.

  • To realise such visions in the future we do need to start with more incremental steps that support such futures.
  • perhaps we can concider how to map these relationships from the existing code and additions in a wiki.
  • My own approach was to build a custom procedure and custom widget that can be used for any practical transclusion, thus allowing each instance of transclusion to be found and catalogued, but only those through my custom code.
  • With the 5.3.0 prerelease through to now, we have discussed placing a custom widget in front of the link widget, to add hackability to any link, but perhaps we can do something similar for transclusions?, even if only tempoary to provide the hooks to collect the information needed to map the structure.
#8

Hi
Really appreciate your posts.

Sorry I’ve been meaning post a proper reply / article
It’s a huge topic
And central i think to TW2025

But instead up on my roof fixing urgent leaks, and more.
Some success but Not fully done yet.
Warm dry weather has left.

soon I hope to return to this thread
And so many others.
Abundance of riches, problems and possibilities

~Jason

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