Request - Make Timestamp On / Off More Configurable

My response here is not entirely on point vis-a-vis the thread’s purpose (Sorry @TW_Tones!), but I’ve often wanted to modify the behavior of that “timestamps off” option.

I do often want to manually override a modified date in order to back-date something (so the timeline tracks something meaningful for my readers). But I’ve never wanted new tiddlers to be created without a create date. Unfortunately, “timestamps off” disables automatic creation dates as well as updating of modified dates.

And, as probably everyone who has ever toggled timestamps off can testify, if you FORGET to turn it back on (after doing whatever needing to be tinkered with), it can create a devil of a mess if you then have a slew of tiddlers entirely lacking in timestamps. (Especially if this has happened more than once, so it’s not necessarily simple to cook up a filter to catch just the recent batch.)

How easy would it be to tweak my “timestamps off” toggle so that there’s conditional behavior, so as to prevent free-floating timestamp-less ?

In other words: If a tiddler LACKS a create date when it’s saved (even with “most timestamps paused”), then saving an edit WOULD still give it a created timestamp (on the variation I’d prefer).

(Honestly I don’t care myself whether a newly created tiddler also gets an automatic modified value; I perefer that all tiddlers that I edit should always have some value in the modified field, whether assigned or automatic. For my use-cases, only a plugin shadow tiddler (or possibly tiddlers from some special-purpose reference set) should be present in my wiki without a modified value. But I’m not as worried about this detail. I just want a guardrail against accidentally generating 100%-timestamp-less tiddlers when I’m distractedly working in the shadow of a minor-touches task that required timestamps off.)

Hi,

Yea, Having no timestamp at all, because you forgot to switch it on - I can feel the pain :wink:

As some users wrote in the related thread, they even switch of created, because for a lot of tiddlers it can reduce wiki size.

The usecase you describe is completely different and “domain specific” as so often with TW.
I can see the desire, to date back the modified field to get a tiddler “back into context” in the timeline. For teachers that makes sense, if users remember: “Ahh we did that 2 months ago”, but the tiddler is in the Recent tab 1 week ago, because it needed some typo fixing and Timestamp On was active :confused:

I think it would be needed that

  • If Timestamp is off
    • The Tool button needs to be forced to be visible
  • There may be 2 buttons
    • One for created field update on/off
    • One for modified field update on/off
  • Hidden settings:
    • Do not create created date
    • Do not create modified date (IMO only for consistency)
    • New dialogue
      • List of checkboxes with field names
      • Button delete them

IMO related and long standing:

I think that would cover all usecases. So IMO it will actually be more work as it first seemed, if it is done consistently. I’m not sure if Jeremy will like that extra complexity. So may be a plugin.

Just brainstorming, no promises.

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Whether import triggers a change in the modified field is probably also something that should be user-configurable.

I actually cross-transfer a whole bunch of reference and utility tiddlers between my own projects, such as vocabulary definitions, biographical sketches, etc., and I generally appreciate that they by default these retain their existing modification dates. (In other words, especially if I was the one who last modified these resources, it’s especially helpful for me that the modification date stays meaningful as when-this-content-was-actually-last-changed.)

But as you say, workflows and wiki purposes do differ! And in some cases (if I wanted students to see certain new-to-them imported stuff in the timeline, even though most “headline” content is created directly in the wiki for that course, rather than being imported), I occasionally do want the import process to include a “touch” step (token modification to set modified timestamp) for some or all of the tiddlers.

It’s easy enough to add a batch-touch step for an imported group. It would be much harder to reconstruct and restore the incoming modification date, though, if the import were to overwrite that info by default. :expressionless:

Thanks for taking up the theme!

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