Does list field automatically links the tiddlers?

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#1

I understand there are three ways to connect tiddlers,

  1. hyperlink [[Example]]
  2. tags
  3. transclusion

In some cases, I want to mention that so and so tiddlers are closely related, just like the “See also” section at the end of Wikipedia articles, without modifying the tiddler’s content.

Wikipedia's "See also" example
Wikipedia's "See also" example1038×512 38.2 KB

In this regard, what is the purpose of the list field? What is the list field effect on the tiddlers by default, without any custom filter or template?

#2

The list field is primarily used for tags, if you reorder them by drag and drop the list field is created and stores the order.

  • You can reuse it for other purposes just don’t do it on a tag tiddler lest you clash.

Keep in mind we may not alter a tiddlers content (the text field) but changing tags or reordering does update the tiddler.

There are also;

  • automatic connections with references and backlinks
  • missing tiddlers - links to non existent tiddlers
  • other fields or searches may connect tiddlers in a list independent from the tiddler eg in your list widgets.
    • This leaves the possibility of other relationships eg tiddlername, can have $:/seealso/tiddlername containing your Wikipedia articles and the view template tests for and transcludes $:/seealso/tiddlername if it exists ie [all[current]addprefix[$:/seealso/]has[title]] then <$transclude/>

Also if timestamps is off adding a tag may not update the modified date

#3

Thanks. So I should probably not repurpose the list field for my “See more” tiddlers. A new custom field would have no clash with TW design.

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#4

Yes and No.

It will be a little more effort but repay you in the long run I think.

  • Use the action listops to manipulate other list fields
  • You can name another field name in the list operator

However for your needs you may find other ways to achieve what you ask.

@Mohammad favourites (the newer folder based one) and basket idea are another way to build lists with drag and drop of titles, they may even use the list field.

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#5

Hm, I’d rather express it as “The list field usually contains tiddler titles”. I.e it is more about “tiddler titles” than “tags” and my phrasing is intended to imply that it really can be used to hold anything. Here’s the official docs.

There’s no particular effect on the tiddler holding the list field. It is just a “storage” like any other field in the tiddler. But it is systemically programmed to be used in a different way from other fields, i.e if it is used / called for. As the name implies the system interprets its content as a list.

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#6

Are you asking how to implement this? It would probably best be done by using a ViewTemplate. If you want to be able to reorder the listed items, then that would be an appropriate use of the list field. If you don’t need to reorder the listed items then it doesn’t really have anything to do with the list field (and the tiddler wouldn’t necessarily have one).

#7

I agree, however if it is a tag tiddler, and you do reorder the tags it spontaneously uses the list field. Common examples are $:/tags/ViewTemplate $:/tags/Stylesheet

  • Titles, and tags and even fieldnames can be the very same thing, titles.
  • I do think the core should have used tag-list for this function, too late now.
#8

Yeah, I got that.

My question was where should I store my “related tiddlers”. In the list field or a new user-field. Either way, template will have to be modified to the use the tiddlers from the field.

True! But if the system utilizes it for tag, then there is a possibility of a clash between my design and the system.

#9

As a rule to do this I leave a hint to myself in the fieldname eg; newname-list and with the relink plugin installed add the new fieldname newname-list to those it keeps up to date, then the list field is maintained if one of the titles within it are renamed.

You may be interested in How to modify tag-picker macro to store values in a different list and myu own effort for a tiddler picker Wikitext and widget MACRO solution for tiddler-picker - HELPed myself - #7 by TW_Tones and specifically https://sandbox-by-tones.tiddlyhost.com/ more of a work in progress and scratch area than published.

  • I am tidying it up now.
#10

But why would you want to store it at all? The typical solution for things like “related tiddlers” would be a dynamic list (i.e a listwidget) that aggregates the related tiddlers, since this is probably not a static set of titles. Because you probably want the list to auto-update if you add or remove a relation, right? So basically, you’d just add a ViewTemplate with a ListWidget to find all the related titles.

Now, if you really do want a static list (…but why?..) then why do you need to bother with a separate field at all? Why can’t you just put it at the bottom of the main text field? If you are to use a separate field and then, I guess, transclude it into the text field, then it makes no difference if it is the list field or a custom field.

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#11

Sigh! Yeah, you are right. I tried my idea and had to retract it.

I was actually exploring different ways to connect the tiddlers.

  1. transclusion
  2. link
  3. tags
  4. field

As it turned out, using a custom field to link tiddlers is fine for one or two tiddlers. But it quickly becomes ungainly and clumsy as the number of tiddlers grows.

The easiest way to use “See more” is to link tiddlers with a tag and then modify the view template to show the tidders with the same tag, which Shiraz’s node explorer already does.

#12

The idea seemed to have weight in my mind. But when I executed it, it fell flat.

#13

Many suns ago I made SeeAlso. Since then, several filter operators etc have been developed for TW so if it was created today maybe it would have used other means, i.e I don’t remember any details about it but it might be worth checking out.